How to Launch Your AgeTech Startup in Japan | The AgeTech Podcast S5E6 with Dominic Carter from Carter JMRN
Japan is often described as a glimpse into the future – a nation where one in three people is already over 65, and technology quietly shapes everyday life. But for AgeTech founders, it’s also one of the hardest markets to crack. In this episode, I sit down with Dominic Carter, CEO of Carter JMRN, to talk about what makes Japan unique, what foreign startups often get wrong, and how building trust can turn cultural barriers into incredible opportunities for innovation.
Catch the full conversation on Youtube, Spotify, Apple Podcasts, or scroll down for the transcript (auto-generated, so pardon any oddities – the bots are still learning!)
Keren Etkin: Dominic, welcome to the show.
Dominic Carter: Thank you, Karen. It’s lovely to be here.
Keren Etkin: Thank you. So last guest we had from the Carter Group on our show was Debbie, and that was around three years ago. Can you maybe bring us up to speed on what has been going on in the Japanese market after, let’s say, let’s start with after the COVID restrictions were lifted and Japan reopened itself to global visitors.
Dominic Carter: Yes. Well, I mean, we’ve been, we’ve been plugging away at our project that focuses on age tech called Living Best for. The last three years and that’s involved we’ve been recruiting a community of professionals, and this could be people who are consultants, academics people working in corporations, you know, anybody.
Anybody who’s interested in the, in the area of age tech has an answer to the challenges that we have in an aging society in Japan. At the same time, we’ve been recruiting a community of rank and file users, if you like, that that exhibit some more kind of leading edge characteristics. So they’re, they’re more open to tech than average, but there’s, there’s still, you know, basically ordinary.
Everyday people and we’ve been recruiting those people face to face over three years. So we have almost a thousand people that we’ve touched. So far, and we’re still going through the process of getting to know these, that, these gu these guys in more detail. But certainly there are several projects that we’ve worked on where we’ve, we’ve enlisted our community’s help both on the professional side and on the user side to basically give us some guidance in terms of how we can best approach introducing some of this innovation into Japan.
Keren Etkin: That is quite remarkable. Over a thousand users, that is a significant user base that you can sort. Reach out to, to get insights from. There is everyone knows that Japan is one of the most aging societies on earth on one hand, and also one of the societies that also has a massive respect for its aging population, which you don’t in the waste quite as much. So there is a
Dominic Carter: Hmm. Hmm.
Keren Etkin: There and there’s a huge interest from startups to tap into that market. Can you maybe talk about some of the unique challenges that foreign startups face when they try to enter the Japanese market?
Dominic Carter: Yes. I mean, language is obviously a big one because not many people in Japan speak English. So even, even just basic communication. Is an issue. Some assumptions about the sophistication of, of the general user in Japan may be incorrect. So in, we’ve done work, you know, basically comparing, um, incidents.
Incidence rates of technology adoption in Japan versus the the us. Um, with two years ago we, we sort of mirrored an A A RP survey and we found that yes, you know, JA Japanese are, are very, you know, they’re very good users of smartphones. And they’re good use of laptops, so penetration’s very high of those two devices.
But when you go into the more kind of applied tech, like smart speakers and so forth, the whole, the whole gamut there’s much less use of technology in Japan than there is, let’s say in in in the US for example. So the, the assumption about the sophistication of the audience as a market for tech in Japan sometimes may be a little bit.
Overestimated. And so yeah, so it can be quite challenging so you have your language problem Also it can be quite slow to build relationships in Japan. So everything works on trust initially. I mean, it does in all human relationships, but, but in Japan in particular, people really do need to know who they’re doing business with before you can really get anywhere.
So it takes longer. There’s a. There’s, there’s more of a commitment that you need, that you possibly need to make in this market compared to some other markets, just in terms of the work that you put into build, building your relationships. But on the other hand, we are the, we are the oldest population of the world.
The median age in Japan is actually 51. And I’m 51, so I’m, I’m not old in Japan, so I have to live here. But you know, you have almost a third of the population who’s over 65. Now, so in a, in a sense, every, everything in Japan, if you’ve got half of the population over 50, you, you could look at every, everything that happens in Japan or every innovation that comes in that has to be adopted really does have an aging.
Aspect to it. Um, so you’ve got a great market here and and it’s obviously a growing market and the, and when you, when you speak to Japanese people, they will tell you that the most pressing social issue that they have is what they do about what they call their super aging society. And I like to think of that it would be, it would be great if we cannot reframe this, if we cannot frame this as a problem all the time, or if we could reframe it as something that looks more like an opportunity.
I think this is a much more positive way of, of looking at what we’re facing here.
Keren Etkin: Absolutely. And it’s, you know, it’s, it is surprising that the country that exports technology globally you still, you still see its older generation not adopting technology quite as much. So the people who built Sony and Toyota, maybe in their later years, only use like their personal device, their laptop or computer, but you don’t see equipping their homes with all of the smart devices that you might see in other countries.
Dominic Carter: Yes, it’s a little bit, it’s a little bit ironic in a way. I mean, there’s a few, there’s a few things at play though. So people stay at home and are looked after by, by their caregivers for longer on average in Japan. So people go into care later. On average. So if you have somebody who’s caring for you, you might not need all of the, all of the technology, right?
The, the, the caregiver, of course, may, may well be open to have something to make their life easier, but if you are, if you are the recipient of that and you’ve got somebody who’s kind of a, basically waiting on you the, the, the need is not, the need is not as high. But, but the issue is in the long term, if we look at, let’s say. People my age in Japan are the largest group in the population. Our generation is looking after the, the older generation. There is currently enough tax base to look after the older generation, but younger than us. If you look at the generation that’s younger than us, there’s certainly not enough people there.
There simply isn’t enough people to, to really adequately. Have that kind of in-home care and, and from a financial perspective it, it’s, um, it’s, it’s an, it’s an issue as well. So so those issues are there. So the, the boomers in a way, um, who traditionally were the largest group in the population in Japan, it’s kind of changing a little bit.
They didn’t have to worry so much about tech. Um. And they, and they, they were looked after. I think it’s really people in my generation who are in their fifties. We’re the ones that really are going to have to be, you know, very, very comfortable with tech and we are going to really have to make up for the gaps in, in, uh, in care that’s gonna be available to us with tech.
So I think, I think it really. It really is incumbent upon people who are sort of in, in my generation and my sort of counterparts who, who are Japanese to, to take to take that on. Having said that, with, with people’s sort of attitudes to tech, I mean if we look at something like robotics, for example older Japanese that we have a quite in Western culture, we have this.
Weird kind of dystopian thing going on about robots and, and tech and eventually it’s gonna take over and possibly kill us. We don’t have that so much in Japan where, you know, tech, tech and, and advancement has always been really not really seen as such a, a negative maybe in some ways. So I think that there’s some.
In some ways there’s more positivity and emotional openness and availability to, to some of some of the tech that’s just around the corner. Thank goodness. Given the, given the, given the challenges that we have,
Keren Etkin: Yes. I recall when I visited Tokyo to attend a Carter JM or an event. went to
Dominic Carter: I.
Keren Etkin: one of the malls and there was just a, a social robot store. At the mall. So they had those, those soft toy robots, I forgot the name, and the para robot. And it was like,
Dominic Carter: Yeah. Yeah.
Keren Etkin: it was surprising. It’s not, not something you expect to see in a mall, but in Japan, I
Dominic Carter: Yeah. The,
Keren Etkin: it’s what I should have
Dominic Carter: yeah. And they’re cute. They’re cute. I think maybe it’s a, or something like that. They’re,
Keren Etkin: Yeah.
Dominic Carter: they’re cute. There’s a certain way, you know, I was having a, having a conversation, um, with a company the other day that’s, that’s produced a, you know, a like a companion, an a toy companion animal with some sort of, you know.
Robot characteristics in it. And I was saying, okay, look, it looks, it looks a little bit too much like a cat, you know, like, actually you don’t have to be quite so representational, um, in Japan. It could just look there, there, there’s a, I can’t remember the name of it, but there’s something that’s launched recently.
I saw it on TV the other night. It’s like just a furry blob and people are going crazy over it. So you know, the way that, the way that stuff. Is responded to and so forth can be sort of, you know, really unique and interesting. And of course that’s why people love coming to Japan because it’s, it can be a little bit quirky like that, but yeah, there is certainly even now popular, popular robots that people are taking into their home.
Keren Etkin: Do you see the,
Dominic Carter: I don’t think they’re particularly useful, but like that, that there is, there is that kind of, you know, openness to it.
Keren Etkin: Speaking of the, the love, the love, love bot or lavo, I’m not sure what the name is that seemed to be a very popular robot. I mean, if it’s sold in malls do
Dominic Carter: Hmm.
Keren Etkin: that the older generation is also receptive of these types of robots, or are they perceived as like toys and gadgets that for kids.
Dominic Carter: I think there are some, there are some people who are very, there are some elderly people who are. Very, very open to all forms of tech and, and would be, would be quite would be quite open to that. I, I. I think it’s, I, yeah, I mean, I, I think if you, if you, if you give, if you give it to someone who’s, you know, past a certain stage, I think it could be very comforting, these sorts of robots.
I’m not sure exactly how closely or profoundly integrated they are into people’s lives at the moment, but, but the potential is certainly there. As they become more intelligent, as, as you become able to converse with them, as the robots are able to sort of adjust the way that they speak with you, to some of the research that we’ve done in robotics is shown that, you know there’s no one way.
It’s kind of obvious, but there’s no one way in which people want to. Interact with the robot. They may want it to be a servant. They may want it to be a friend. You know, whatever it is that may have something to do with the way that they interact with the people in their life, um, already. But I think that as.
You know, they’re, they’re probably a bit gimmicky at the moment, but I think as the, as, as the tech improves and as I think people are able to more sort of authentically engage with them, I think it’s gonna become more and more, more and more important. But, but, but basically people are
are
pretty, pretty happy
pretty,
to, to be, to be working with robots.
And I, I suspect that that doesn’t have the kind of. Possible stigma that it has in, in western countries that like, there’s this movie called Megan, I dunno if you’ve seen it. And, and it’s this sort of silly movie about a, a companion robot for a little girl that kind of takes over and becomes very antisocial and ends up trying to kill everybody.
But that’s a, that’s a very kind of western trope about. About robots and, and I think it, I think it doesn’t really, it doesn’t really hold in Japan where we, we have astroboy and atten boy, you know, atten boy slash astroboy and whatever has been sort of part of the, part of the culture, so,
Keren Etkin: Yeah, it’s definitely a, there is
Dominic Carter: yeah.
Keren Etkin: Difference in the way robots are perceived in Japan
Dominic Carter: Hmm.
Keren Etkin: in the west. So assuming we have people in the audience who are starting out their age tech journey and they want to build something that could apply to the Japanese market as well what types of unsolved. Challenges or unsolved needs. Do you see that Japan’s older population currently has that isn’t being served by traditional means or with technology?
Dominic Carter: Yes. I think that, well, it’s, it, they’re, they’re very similar to. The issues that I think people would have anywhere. So in terms of what the, in terms of what the basic, basic needs are I think that I, I think caregiving is a big burden. ’cause as I say, I think that a lot of the slack in terms of this what, what, what happens as, as, as people age is taken up by family members in Japan and it’s still, even though it’s not as.
It’s not as prevalent as it used to be. A lot of it, a lot of the, the burden of care falls on family members. So I think that ways that we can help people who are caregivers I think is very is very important. Um, I think there’s, there, there’s a lot of interest in people staying healthy so that they’re not a burden on others.
It’s very unacceptable in Japanese culture to, to just. You know, ex to be a burden to other people and expect other people to, um, take care of you before you, before you really need it. So things that keep you, things that keep you kind of mentally sharp as well. So things like brain training. Um, I think has a lot of has a lot of potential in Japan and, and, and we are, look, we’re looking at projects in that, that area as well.
And it’s actually not just, it’s not just for people who are aging, like every, you know, there’s a wide range of people who are interested in something like brain training for example. So if you have, if, if you have a, if you have a product that can have sort of like a wide age appeal and it doesn’t, it doesn’t have to be.
Specifically targeted at, at aging adults. It may, it, it may have a wider application that also gets taken up by aging adults and is very useful. I think that might be one way of, of looking at it as well. But whatever it is that you do I think it’s very, very important that we first of all determine whether, whether there, there actually is.
A real demand or a real need for what it is that you are, what it is that you are making. And, uh, we, we’ve done in the last six months about 170 pure product concept tests of every, every type of, um, age tech concept you could imagine. So we’ve kind of scoured the world and tested. Tested people’s concepts and we’re, we’re, we’re, we’re communicating with, with some of the companies that, that, that, whose, whose concepts we’ve we, we’ve tested.
But I think it’s very important to establish, first of all that there actually is a, a genuine need for for what it is that you are making. And, and people, people come to those tasks with a lot of heart energy and they really want to, you know, they, they, they really do want to help people. But. You know, there, there’s, there’s a high failure rate of of, of those, those innovations.
And I think some of it has to do with maybe not being quite the right.
Right.
Concept for, for the market in the first place. So I think, you know, I, we, we can talk about what all of the potential opportunities, unmet needs are and whatever. I think they’re very similar in Japan as they are in other, in other countries.
But, you know, I think it’s very, very important to do some sort of research and validation as if, if you are, if you are looking, looking at the market here,
Yeah,
and then yes, we move on to. Let’s actually work with users and, and, and work at how we can, how we can adapt so that this, if it’s a great idea, we can actually make it work in real life.
But that’s kind of the way that we. We, we tend to look at it. So everything’s an opportunity. In theory, um, in in practice, you know, what, what is you know, what, what will work and what is actually definitely worth working on and investing in may be a small number out of a large number of possible concepts.
Keren Etkin: So, see, you mentioned that you had over a hundred
Dominic Carter: Hmm.
Keren Etkin: Tested, Japanese
Dominic Carter: almost 200 actually. Yeah. Yeah.
Keren Etkin: That, that is a lot. Were most of these concepts newly formed and to meet Japan as the first market? Or were some of these proven concepts from other markets and the companies just wanna test how it’s gonna work for them in Japan?
Dominic Carter: Yes,
Yeah.
it, it’s a mix. Some of them, what, what we did is we looked at, we, we looked at a whole range of different startups, mostly. And we, we, we, we, we, we, we looked at what they were doing. And so when
so.
We, the way that we did our surveys, we said it’s based on a survey of, of users who age 40 to 80 and population representatives.
So we’re sort of getting people who might be buying for their parents as well as people who might be buying for themselves and so forth. And so we, we, we surveyed at the level of, a product that that meets this need and works this way. We’re testing. Would this be interesting to you? If we had, if we had a pro, you know, if we had a brain training product that could, you know, give you measurable feedback on your progress, or it could, you know, improve your cognitive ability measurably or, you know, whatever, whatever it is a special type of wheelchair or hearing aid or, you know, what, what, what, whatever it was just at a very, sort of pure product level, a product that does this.
A product does this, you know, would, how, how interesting would it be? Would you buy it for yourself? Would you buy it for someone else? Would you let someone else buy it for you? You know, tho those, those sorts of questions. And so we sort of have ended up where
where.
we’ve now got a fairly good idea of how, what the, what the sort of raw, theoretical potential of, of the, of, of these concepts are.
So we’ve isolated, maybe. One in 20 of those concepts as being what I’d call kind of superstars that we say, okay, this is in in, in the market, these these products look like they, they, they’ll have a momentum. Like they, they’re so attractive that they’re gonna have a momentum of their own. And, and I, I, the reason why I want to focus on those.
High potential concepts is that
that.
A difficult market to enter. It’s difficult for Japanese companies to launch into. It’s difficult for overseas companies to launch into it. So we really wanna start on third run. We really wanna start on third base. Um, and, I think in the, in the bigger picture, I wanna make sure that we can create some wins in age tech.
So that we can point to we can point to some success and sort of avoid, avoid the possibility that, that people just throw their hands up and say it’s too, it’s too difficult.
Too
You know, the, because we know the user issues are very difficult, obviously, um, aging adults are, are not, you know, they’re not so great at, picking up tech, they need help to, to do it. If you’re talking about B2B buyers or, you know, care facilities, whatever, they’ve got their own organizational issues that that can make adopting new, new, new technology challenging. So, so what, what our objective in living best is basically to find some kind of hero hero concepts that we can that we can work with.
So some success and then like. Lighter path for the next ones to come and create some, create some very successful stories so that we’re not permanently talking about the potential of this sector or actually. Delivering some actual measurable findings. So we, we, sorry, some measurable results. So we, we’ve, um, yeah, we’ve set a pretty high, pretty high high bar for what we need to do.
But, but yeah, I really think that that’s what we need to do in, in age tech is just be, be, be really trying to find projects where we can get some, where we can get some early wins. The bigger picture and the more sort of long range projects, of course, they are also being worked on and they’re also exceptionally important and, and they will, they will come in.
But for what we need to do
to
and to sort of, I think, pave the way, especially on the user side to get to get. Everyday people excited about age tech, I think is something that we, we, we need to do. And, and in order to do that, it’s way too theoretical to talk to them about like, here’s what it could be like in five years, or here’s what it could be like in 10 years.
We, we’ve gotta say, here’s something that you, here’s something that you, that you can use right now that will improve your life right now or that will help you with the challenge you have looking after your mom or your dad right now, or is gonna make life easier for you as an aging adult right now. And, and that’s, that’s kind of what we’re focused on.
And they’re the, they’re the projects that we’re that we’re currently focused on.
Keren Etkin: Absolutely. you say that
Dominic Carter: Yeah.
Keren Etkin: we look at like founder market fit, generally speaking, founder market fit in the age tech
Dominic Carter: Mm-hmm.
Keren Etkin: It generally, I would say that it’s best to have someone on the founding team with access to the market and with experience in the market. Would you say that for international startups who try to enter the Japanese market. They should have someone with some Japanese background on the founding team. Someone who either was born and raised in Japan or has spent a significant
Dominic Carter: Hmm.
Keren Etkin: of
Dominic Carter: Yeah.
Keren Etkin: in their lives living in Japan and sort of immersing themselves in the culture.
Dominic Carter: I think it, I, I think it helps sometimes though the, the, that, that can, that can help, but of course it may not be enough because Japan’s such a, you know, such a unique place. So I think that helps and, and certainly helps in the motivation of the startup. If you’ve got somebody who’s. You know who pro who profiles like that on, on the founding team.
I think it’s very important to have a Japanese partner somehow in this. So it it, my, my sort of ideal scenario for a startup would be if you can find someone in Japan who you can partner with, uh, it’s very, very hard if you don’t have, if you don’t have a Ja, like a, like a a, a Japanese person in there helping you.
Helping you with your meetings and just developing those relationships. It’s just a little bit too hard. Even, even if you’ve got some in, even if you’ve got a genuine, authentic interest or some, some sort of background you know, maybe your parents are Japanese or whatever it is, but, but you need somebody who.
I think it, it really lives in the market here and, and knows how to, knows how to talk to people and knows how to do business development and knows how to, knows how to behave in, in, in expected ways in in Japan I think is very important. And if you can. If you, and, and that, so that’s, that’s not enough to have someone like that.
I mean, they need you because you are the one bringing the innovation. So I think that, that trust, that trusting relationship that you need to have you need, you need the market to trust you. But, but where trust has to start is between you and. Who it is, you might work as your local partner. And if you could find somebody who’s really values wise, a fit for you and who’s really genuinely excited by what it is that you are doing, and then you know, that person will probably do amazing things working with you.
But I think you really need to, you really need to have somebody who is who is local. To, to work with you. And it will just make life a lot easier. It’s just very, very difficult unless you’ve got somebody who’s really, really well penetrated into, into those networks and knows how to do all of the all of the, the, the groundwork and the spade work that you, you need to do if you’re gonna be selling into, into the market.
So, yeah, it, it, it, it, it’s a matter of, you know, obviously you’ve gotta come here, you’ve gotta meet people, you’ve gotta work out, you know, you’ve gotta meet people where there’s good chemistry good competence and chemistry and all of that kind of thing. And I think work it from there. And of course, as I’m very happy to help startups as well, you know, if we can, if through the community connections that we’ve got, of course, if we could, if there are people that we know who we think would be.
Interesting people to to meet or to speak with or to advise or, you know, what have you. I’m only too happy to, um, only too happy to do that. But yeah, like that, that, to, to be working in, to be working in this market, you need, you, you really do need to have somebody on the ground who’s really very committed to you.
Keren Etkin: Absolutely. So it’s either,
Dominic Carter: Yeah.
Keren Etkin: hire someone have on your team to, to be the boots on the ground or, or work with a partner. Is it, you say that it’s possible for startups who have, let’s say startup who have a product that isn’t so, it doesn’t, that doesn’t require localization.
Dominic Carter: Mm-hmm.
Keren Etkin: a, a distributor.
Is that, is that something that startups can do? Because I’ve seen startups do it in, in
Dominic Carter: Yes.
Keren Etkin: markets, just
Dominic Carter: Yes, yes.
Keren Etkin: sometimes even on their own brand, and they get, they just get the job done.
Dominic Carter: Yes, E everyone wants to do that, of course. But, but, but yes, I think it’s, I think it’s possible. I mean, I can give you an example maybe like, we’re working with a company called Comfort Linen and it’s, uh, it’s not digital tech. I mean, it’s, it’s fiber tech. There is, there is, um, there is, um, some definite ip, um, in, in, in, in the product.
Product itself, but it, they’re, they’re sheets and pajamas that are low friction. So if people have Parkinson’s or movement disorders especially Parkinson’s disease, that, that of, of course the sufferers of Parkinson’s tend to be older. Um, this makes life a lot easier in bed now. There’s very little adaptation that needs to be done with that product.
It’s, it’s just the, it’s just. The bed sizing and the, and the, and the, and the clothing sizing. You just need to make different sizing. And so in that sense, yes. You know, that can be and we’re, we’re working with, we’re working with that company at the moment to, to sort of get distribution for them.
And we’re, we’re, we’re, we’re, you know, basically we’ve launched an e-commerce site. Very recently, and we’re looking at B2B channels and so forth, and that product doesn’t require very much adaptation. So there are products that don’t require that much adaptation. Um, and, you know, yes you can, if you can find a distributor, that’s good, but, but the, but the issue with distributors is, you, you, if you go with the first one you meet, they may, there’ll, there’ll be a reason why they’re interested in your product, but it may not be the reason. You may not be wanting quite the same thing. So they may only want one product out of your range, or they may be looking just to plug something. And so the rest of what you do may not be of interest to, to them or, so they won’t, they won’t sell it.
They won’t push it. And so there can be a lot of, and just one example, but there can be a lot of misunderstandings between companies and distributors in terms of expectations and and and so forth. So, I think it’s probably safer to have a partner here who could probably help you work through the different distributors that you may need to work with.
You may need to work with more than one distributor or the type of. The type of distributor that you need to work with may change over time and just to sort of help you, help you develop that I think is probably a bit safer than just going with the first one. The first one that you meet. It’s very, very important that you know them, that that you know each other very well, even.
Even if you think that it’s a fairly simple task for the distributor, I think you need to get to know them.
Keren Etkin: Yeah, absolutely. It absolutely does make sense to yeah, not, not just. Necessarily sign with the first distributor that shows interest? ’cause they might have, I assume some of them have like, catalogs of products that they distribute if they’re B2B and they just might want something to fill a void. But like you said, they, they
Dominic Carter: Correct. Yes.
Keren Etkin: In whatever else that the company has to offer. Although for a startup, it’s often
Dominic Carter: Yeah.
that they have anyway. Mm-hmm.
Yes, yes. I mean, look, distributors also may, may take you on just to stop you. They’ll sometimes, they’ll sometimes take, take product on to, to sort of control it in the market. If they, if they view it as being a threat, you know, there, there’s all, there’s all sorts of. Dynamics that happen and it, it’s very, as I say, it’s just very, very important to get to know them.
What’s their track record in, in the area? Like how committed do they look like? To you. And of course if you’re a startup, there are things are gonna go wrong. So how patient are they gonna be with you with the, with the challenges that you have and, uh, you know, maybe in production or, you know, whatever it is.
So I think you’re really looking for, I, I think even if it seems like a simple distribution task, you really are looking for someone who can partner with you and, and partnering with you means that. You know, both sides have gotta kind of, they’ve gotta give something into that relationship. And you know, it can’t just be a case of you give this to me and I do this, and if you don’t, you know, if you don’t deliver, I don’t do what I’m supposed to do.
Like, you really, you really wanna work with people that I think really believe in what it is that you’re doing. Like they believe in, in what we are doing in aging related innovation. And they believe in you. They like you and they want to, they want to support you. I think that personal part of it, I think is super, super important because sometimes that’s all you’ve got.
And, uh, I, I, yeah. Yeah.
Keren Etkin: So last question is, about sort of what brought you to start the Carter Associates, and also you’ve been doing this for decades you are not, you weren’t born in Japan. So what would you say is like the number one, counterintuitive thing that you’ve learned over the past years when
Dominic Carter: Oh, well, yeah, I, yeah. Well lots. I mean, when I heard you ask, so I, I guess sort of one of the interesting thing, maybe this is, this is about me a a little bit, but, but I I learned. To listen a lot more being in this market. Um, and it, it’s kind of, I laugh when I, I really have to laugh when I think about it, but when I came to Japan, at first I really thought I was here to teach.
And it’s ridiculous because I was in my early twenties. But, but you know, I thought, okay, you know, I’m gonna and I, I think, I think this can be a very humbling market for you if you don’t listen and you don’t really, you don’t genuinely respect. And I, I think, you know, if you don’t respect the market will teach you respect.
And that can be a very, that can be a very, um, uncomfortable uncomfortable experience. But I think one of the aspects of respect that’s Im important cross-culturally is that we don’t try to cha, we don’t look at people and say, why do we do it that way? Like, why do, like, a classic example is like websites in Japan, like websites in Japan to foreigners look absolutely madcap, they look ridiculous.
Like the amount of information on there and, and just how much, and we look at it and, but, but of course, you know, from, from the Japanese user perspective, like they’re,
Like
they’re, the way that they look for information and the way they make decisions is, you know, in, in some ways a little bit different.
To us. So respecting the market, respecting the user is actually about listening to what they tell you. Like a lot of, a lot of businesses come into, come into the market and they want to apply their playbook that works in other markets, and they’ll say, oh, well it works in China. Why doesn’t it work here?
Or it works in America, or, you know and I think success is found by, by listening and people, and people will tell you what they want. They’ll tell you what they like and what they don’t like and what they would like to see changed in your approach and your products. And I, and I think over the years, the, the people that have listened to that are the ones that I’ve seen succeed.
And, and sometimes it may appear odd. Why, why do you know, for example, in food, why do Japanese people like, you know stuff that has, you know a weaker taste, a weaker flavor? Why in, you know, take it out of age and cleaning products. I remember working on a project where, where literally we were going in and cleaning bathrooms with, with people, and they were saying, well, I don’t want the pro, I don’t actually want the product to clean too well.
Because when I come back tomorrow, I’m not gonna have anything to do. And you know, I don’t want a product that work that I don’t want an all in one product that will clean everything, you know? So in a, in a sense, sometimes when, when things are too efficacious or when they prob when they solve problems too effectively it creates these, these, these, these other issues.
And I, and, and I think you might even see a bit of those sort of human factors in, in age tech as well. So yeah, I think it’s, uh, I, I think it’s, uh, that people are different sometimes in unexpected, in un in unexpected ways, in, in the way that they respond to things. And I think you do well by listening.
And I’ve had to learn, of course, everyone has to learn it the hard way. And, uh. You know, I, I still struggle sometimes ’cause I have strong opinions, but, but, but but yeah, I think listening and observing and responding I think is, is, is really important.
Keren Etkin: And so the concept of wabi sabi translates to cleaning product as well.
Dominic Carter: It, it might, it might. Well, I mean, I think the, the, the, but it’s kind of relevant in a sense to when, when we do talk about age related information. ’cause the most important thing is to do no harm in, in, in, in Japanese culture. It’s more important to do no harm than to solve the problem. So if you are in, if you are from a culture that just goes in and fixes things all the time which, which we tend to be like westerners tend to be that way whereas Japanese always look at the downside first.
So they’re, they’re, because they’re very risk averse. So there are certain problems that may just persist because. There’s just a perceived risk in addressing the problem. And, and, and of course people will admit that that’s not helping us get anywhere, but you have to be very aware of the psychology that people you know, that sort of is part of, part of people.
So, yeah, doing no harm is more important than solving the problem. Explains or, or it’s a big explanation for why a lot of problems remain unsolved. So, yeah, it’s just something that we, something that we have to work with and adapt to. The user in the market is not gonna adapt to you. You are gonna adapt to the user.
And it is, it is rare. It is rare. I, I’ve, I’ve not seen though that many concepts that can just go straight into Japan without some sort of, without some sort of adaptation. So yeah, really, really requires a lot of active listening and a lot of humility and maybe a lot of relearning of common sense.
But, but that’s, you know. Culture is common sense, right? So if you are moving across cultures, your sense, your, your sense of what is common sense will differ. So you need to you need to think of that, but it’s, it’s really fun. Like it’s a really fun journey if you’re actually, if, if you are interested in that kind of thing.
It’s, it’s, it’s really, really rewarding I think.
Keren Etkin: Absolutely. And yeah, it does require a lot of unlearning and relearning to, to make things work. And in such a market that is so culturally different markets, I don’t, I don’t think it’s even possible to describe it to people with words. People just have to come to Japan physically and, and
Dominic Carter: That’s right. Yeah.
Keren Etkin: Just how. Some of the fundamental things that we take for granted in Western cultures, and perhaps we shouldn’t, perhaps we should like, reevaluate them. In Japan, the, the things are done just done completely differently. For better or
Dominic Carter: Yeah.
Keren Etkin: for my experience, a
Dominic Carter: Yeah.
Keren Etkin: lot of the stuff that I experienced was like better for, for the older adults in the population, which I thought was like. Amazing.
Dominic Carter: Yes. Well, people respect, people respect. Aging adults in Japan. Like, it, it, it’s, it’s a real thing. And I think this is a great place to grow old personally, I’m looking for, I think I’m growing old now. I, I’m, I’m, I’m, I’m, I’m looking forward to it here. I think, I think it, I think it’s gonna be great. So, yeah.
Keren Etkin: That’s awesome and that you can actually look forward to aging in place that you will be a respected member of society into your eighties,
Dominic Carter: so far I’m enjoying getting older. Karen, I dunno. I mean, maybe there might come a point where I’m like, we can stop the clock here. But, but, but, but I, but yeah, I feel, I, I, I feel very, I feel very optimistic about you know, what it will be like to grow older in Japan, people are, people are kind and, and, and the, the.
The society is, is, is well aware of what it, of what it needs to do. I think there are a lot of challenges, but I think that I, I think that people are honored and they recognize what the, what their responsibility is and, but, but it has to be, one of the things that, you know, we want to do with age tech is to help people to understand their own personal responsibility to help in that.
And, and having good facility with tech, I think is actually really part of that whole picture of, of addressing this challenge we have.
Keren Etkin: Absolutely. so that was actually my last question. Is there anything that we didn’t talk about that you would like to add? Any call to action to people in the audience?
Dominic Carter: Well, I, like, I, I, you know, maybe I said some things that might sound a little bit scary and discouraging about coming here, but I want, but I want people to come and challenge themselves and I, I, I, I really, you know, the more people that show interest in Japan. I think the better it’s going to be for Japan.
I think we need, we need new ideas and, and I, I really welcome them and, and, and we’re very, we’re very receptive to new ideas. So I don’t want people to be put off by what I’m saying. The challenges are. It’s just like, you can be, you can be really successful in Japan. It’s if you like, if you sort of do.
If you have your wits about you and know what it is that you need to do and sort of do those things, I’m saying listen, respond respect, you know, all of that kind of stuff. It, this can be like a super, super fantastic, rewarding place, to be in. So I really want, you know, contact me. I’m always happy to speak to, to anybody who’s looking at anybody who’s looking at the market.
And, uh, yeah, I’d love to hear some really, really breakthrough new. Ideas and concepts, um, in age tech.
Keren Etkin: Thank you. Thank you Dominic. And for everyone listening and we’re or watching us the Carter JMRN group has some fantastic resources on the website, so I would highly encourage anyone to check that out. Dominic, thank you so much for joining me on the show today. It was as always a pleasure chatting with you.
Dominic Carter: Thank you, Keren.